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hey guys ryan here the summer in the

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skies podcast is a labor of love every

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week and with that comes many different

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give what you think the show is worth

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join visit patreon.com

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somewhereskies thank you for your

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[Music]

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from the early 1950s until 2009 a

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department in the united kingdom's

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ministry of defense documented and

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investigated reports of ufos

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in 2007 many of those formerly

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classified reports had been made

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available to the public for the very

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first time

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here nick pope former staff member for

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the ufo desk at the mod explains why

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this release of files occurred december

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2007

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the ministry of defense made a policy

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decision to release its entire archive

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of ufo files

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twelve thousand citing reports going

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back to the 50s

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policy files files on how to handle this

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subject when it's raised in parliament

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or by the media

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public correspondence files

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all sorts of files

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why was this decision taken

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three main reasons

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reason number one the french government

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had recently disclosed their

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archive of ufo

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cnes the french national space

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research institute has custody of of the

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ufo issue in france but they had

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made a decision to release their files

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so many people tried to log on to the

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website that it crashed

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an indication though of the phenomenal

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public and media interest in this

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subject but the french government

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disclosed and that said precedent which

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made it more difficult for us in in the

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uk to

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hold out on this

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the second reason is that the ministry

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of defense felt and the government felt

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in a wider sense that this would be an

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interesting issue on which to

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demonstrate

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the government's commitment to open

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government and freedom of information

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the third reason is i think the most

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interesting one the ministry of defense

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receives more foi requests on ufos than

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any other single subject

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there is immense interest in this

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subject in in the uk immense pressure on

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the government and of course the

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workload involved in responding to these

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freedom of information act requests on a

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case-by-case basis was intolerable and

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the flip side the downside of that is

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that the people

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doing now the job that i was doing in

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the early 90s are spending so much time

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on responding to these foi requests that

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they're having very little time to do

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anything which could be remotely

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categorized as meaningful

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in terms of investigation or research

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into the phenomenon i i think that's a a

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serious issue so for all those reasons

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in december 2007

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the mod made that policy decision we are

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going to release the whole lot

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the uk's fascination with ufos spiked

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around 1950 prompting the mod to form

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the flying saucer working party to

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address the phenomenon according to the

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uk national archives

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ufos in the early 1950s even captured

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the attention of prime minister winston

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churchill who sent a memo to his heir

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minister in 1952 asking quote what does

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all this stuff about flying saucers

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amount to

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what can it mean

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what is the truth

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end quote

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the flying saucer working party

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concluded that ufos were either hoaxes

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delusions or ordinary objects that were

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misidentified

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recommending quote that no further

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investigation of reported mysterious

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aerial phenomena be undertaken

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since then it has been rumored that ufo

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investigations continued in some

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capacity within the mod

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but many who witnessed ufos that were

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reported to the mod

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certainly didn't believe that what they

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saw was a hoax a delusion or a

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misidentification

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one of those witnesses was milton torres

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torres was the united states air force

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pilot

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stationed overseas in 1957 during the

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cold war taurus not only witnessed a ufo

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over the english countryside but was

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ordered to fire upon it

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after over 50 years of remaining silent

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on what happened that day he finally

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came forward with his story after these

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mod files vindicated his account

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this is the story of milton taurus and

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his official orders to shoot down a ufo

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the mod

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released the story

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that i've kept

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what a relief

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[Music]

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i can talk about it

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this is somewhere in the skies with ryan

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spread

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milton torres joined the us air force in

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1951 and was commissioned as a

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lieutenant in 1954 serving in britain as

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a fighter pilot

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in 1961 he earned a bachelor of science

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degree in engineering and became a range

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control officer at cape canaveral for

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the gemini and apollo space programs

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later he flew

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276 combat missions in the vietnam war

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and earned 13 air medals including the

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distinguished flying cross

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he attained the rank of major before

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retiring from military service in 1971.

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he'd seen many things in the skies

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during his decorated career

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but it was in 1957 that something in the

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skies would change his life forever

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it was may 20th 1957.

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taurus was stationed at raf manson in

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air force base in east anglia england

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this is his story in his own words as he

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recalls what happened that extraordinary

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day

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when i first came to manson the first

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thing we had to do

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was to quote

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transition to the new airplane while i

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was already transitioned

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i was

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trained at paran air force base in texas

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which did nothing train f-86 deep

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violence

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okay when i got there

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we had everybody in the squadron had to

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get up to the speed at the same level

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we went fired rocketry at tripoli we did

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all kinds of things

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once we finally knew what we were doing

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so they say they put us on alert that we

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had to take a share of the alert this is

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for the raf

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and

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the usaf depending on whoever which

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airplanes were on on duty we would be on

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alert waiting to be scrabbled now the

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scrambles usually were nothing more than

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some airliner that was lost or or

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somebody up there that was in trouble

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they wanted us to come up and lead them

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in that's usually what happened when i

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got this scramble this is a different

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story we were at the end of the runway

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in our alert shack waiting for a

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scramble order and went i got it

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it was somewhere near midnight i

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remember the exact time but it was very

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close to midnight

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i scrambled we got into the airplane and

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took off the minute i took off i checked

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into the gci site

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which was given to me when i took off

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and the gci advised me pick up ahead of

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your one two zero and go gate which i

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was already at gate which means going

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after burner all the way

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the the soup was so thick you couldn't

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it was a set of clouds that went from

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the ground up to 32 000 feet and i

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couldn't see a thing it was one of these

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pieces of fogs that they had in england

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at the time

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and during this these piece of fogs this

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is when they were

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they were burning coal mostly in england

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and therefore the fogs were really tough

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the minute i got airborne they were

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there actually

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before i got airborne they indicated

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this would be a hot fire measure

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hot fire i turned and says you will be

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ordered to fire 24 rockets

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well that's a very

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uh

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heavy order the the kind of order that

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you demand an authentication so i picked

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up my little matrix and and

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went through the month authentication

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procedure and i looked down and they

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gave me two letters uh they said yes

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this is our problem that means i have to

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fire

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first i i my first concern was jesus

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this is the first shot of world war

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three i didn't want to hear that you

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know but nevertheless that's what it

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ran through my mind

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i i just went through the motions

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i was ordered to fire on this machine

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and i was going to fire on and i would

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go sabo rocks 24 that was my orders 24

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rockets that's the whole load of shop

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so as far as i was concerned that was my

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orders and that's all i was going to do

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and being a good fighter pilot i thought

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anyway i'm going to obey my orders and

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salute and say yes sir and proceed ahead

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i had no idea what it was so we

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continued on the mission i selected the

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raucous i was ready to go they advised

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me uh

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to turn on a heading there'd be a fire

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heavy we

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actually made what they call an intern

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vector

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so that means my wingman

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was

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about five miles behind me

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would turn we would turn on the same

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vector and we would come into this

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whatever there was a bomber or whatever

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they they advised me

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look on your port side at about 15 miles

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that's where it's at sure enough there

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was

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as big as i said before as big as an

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aircraft carrier as far as the flip was

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concerned it was an easy lock on very

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easy my radar was telling me that i was

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giving i got about 200 not overtake on

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him over what he was going and i was

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going at mach point

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uh 8.92

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being mach 1 would be around 750 we

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couldn't go that fast at any rate i had

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a

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solid lock

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and now

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it came in the target and

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it gives you a circle

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on the radar and

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in that circle they have another little

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circle

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and it has the chisel band the chisel

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band is the is the band you see on the

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radar when it goes round and round

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00:12:47,190 --> 00:12:45,440
except in our case it was held still

286
00:12:49,590 --> 00:12:47,200
because i was locked on

287
00:12:51,350 --> 00:12:49,600
anyway as i was going in

288
00:12:53,110 --> 00:12:51,360
i looked up there my overtake was

289
00:12:56,150 --> 00:12:53,120
holding at about

290
00:12:59,190 --> 00:12:56,160
uh 250 300 knots somewhere in that

291
00:13:02,790 --> 00:12:59,200
neighborhood uh closure rate

292
00:13:05,910 --> 00:13:02,800
and then all of a sudden i got the

293
00:13:07,110 --> 00:13:05,920
started to shrink this means i i'm going

294
00:13:09,590 --> 00:13:07,120
to tell him

295
00:13:12,230 --> 00:13:09,600
i said judy you know

296
00:13:14,230 --> 00:13:12,240
which means to them that uh i've got the

297
00:13:16,949 --> 00:13:14,240
complete intercept on my own

298
00:13:18,710 --> 00:13:16,959
i'm ready to fire i pulled the trigger

299
00:13:20,710 --> 00:13:18,720
and nothing happened but it

300
00:13:22,870 --> 00:13:20,720
was coming in and just about two or

301
00:13:25,910 --> 00:13:22,880
three seconds to go it's supposed to go

302
00:13:31,110 --> 00:13:25,920
into a flat line where i just put the

303
00:13:33,910 --> 00:13:31,120
the the dot on the on the line and the

304
00:13:35,750 --> 00:13:33,920
radar takes over all computations and

305
00:13:36,870 --> 00:13:35,760
fires the missiles if i have it

306
00:13:38,710 --> 00:13:36,880
depressed

307
00:13:41,350 --> 00:13:38,720
well that didn't happen next thing i

308
00:13:43,829 --> 00:13:41,360
know i look up i see the

309
00:13:46,470 --> 00:13:43,839
drizzle band was in center and this blip

310
00:13:47,430 --> 00:13:46,480
was going straight north straight away

311
00:13:52,310 --> 00:13:47,440
from me

312
00:13:54,550 --> 00:13:52,320
i estimate mach 10

313
00:13:55,990 --> 00:13:54,560
because it was so fast

314
00:13:59,269 --> 00:13:56,000
and

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00:14:00,550 --> 00:13:59,279
the raf told me this time that we've

316
00:14:04,069 --> 00:14:00,560
lost our

317
00:14:06,870 --> 00:14:04,079
our target he's off our

318
00:14:08,629 --> 00:14:06,880
radar completely and we have a 250 mile

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00:14:10,310 --> 00:14:08,639
scope and he's gone

320
00:14:12,870 --> 00:14:10,320
and i said well he's gone with me too

321
00:14:15,430 --> 00:14:12,880
he's it's out he's out of range i'm

322
00:14:17,829 --> 00:14:15,440
returning and going home so i did and i

323
00:14:19,509 --> 00:14:17,839
and they've activated home plates

324
00:14:22,550 --> 00:14:19,519
at any rate well that's when they told

325
00:14:24,150 --> 00:14:22,560
me that uh call me on the land line and

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00:14:25,509 --> 00:14:24,160
i got the rest of the information on the

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00:14:27,509 --> 00:14:25,519
landline

328
00:14:29,030 --> 00:14:27,519
then they told me that the

329
00:14:30,949 --> 00:14:29,040
the british

330
00:14:32,550 --> 00:14:30,959
were sending somebody down from london

331
00:14:33,670 --> 00:14:32,560
to debrief me

332
00:14:35,750 --> 00:14:33,680
and that's

333
00:14:38,310 --> 00:14:35,760
all that happened that day

334
00:14:40,310 --> 00:14:38,320
taurus landed and was told to wait to

335
00:14:42,870 --> 00:14:40,320
hear from his superiors

336
00:14:45,430 --> 00:14:42,880
he was then ushered into a room in the

337
00:14:47,910 --> 00:14:45,440
squadron operations area where a

338
00:14:51,350 --> 00:14:47,920
well-dressed american civilian in a dark

339
00:14:54,949 --> 00:14:51,360
blue trench coat was waiting for him and

340
00:14:57,189 --> 00:14:54,959
this guy the spook comes in and i had no

341
00:14:59,509 --> 00:14:57,199
idea who he was or what anyway he

342
00:15:00,949 --> 00:14:59,519
flashed a card that wasn't national

343
00:15:02,389 --> 00:15:00,959
security but it was a official

344
00:15:04,629 --> 00:15:02,399
government bag

345
00:15:07,110 --> 00:15:04,639
he was a spook that's all i knew so i

346
00:15:09,350 --> 00:15:07,120
told him the whole story and he told me

347
00:15:11,430 --> 00:15:09,360
no uncertain term don't tell anybody

348
00:15:12,870 --> 00:15:11,440
this has been declared top secret and if

349
00:15:15,430 --> 00:15:12,880
you open your mouth to anybody that

350
00:15:17,750 --> 00:15:15,440
includes your commander or your wingmen

351
00:15:20,629 --> 00:15:17,760
or anybody else you open up your mouth

352
00:15:22,790 --> 00:15:20,639
to anybody and says we'll get you off

353
00:15:23,509 --> 00:15:22,800
the flying status that was enough for me

354
00:15:25,590 --> 00:15:23,519
to

355
00:15:30,069 --> 00:15:25,600
be quiet for the rest of the time

356
00:15:32,949 --> 00:15:30,079
and for over 52 years taurus kept silent

357
00:15:35,509 --> 00:15:32,959
but the event never left his mind

358
00:15:37,829 --> 00:15:35,519
it ate away at him for many years

359
00:15:39,350 --> 00:15:37,839
knowing that he had to keep his oath of

360
00:15:43,030 --> 00:15:39,360
silence

361
00:15:45,030 --> 00:15:43,040
and then the mod files were released

362
00:15:47,910 --> 00:15:45,040
and within the pages was a lengthy

363
00:15:50,389 --> 00:15:47,920
written statement by taurus about what

364
00:15:54,069 --> 00:15:50,399
he had experienced

365
00:15:57,269 --> 00:15:54,079
at the 2009 x conference alongside nick

366
00:15:59,829 --> 00:15:57,279
pope taurus had this to say about what

367
00:16:02,389 --> 00:15:59,839
he believed it was that he witnessed

368
00:16:05,749 --> 00:16:02,399
that night in the skies above east

369
00:16:08,470 --> 00:16:05,759
anglia i have convinced myself that this

370
00:16:10,470 --> 00:16:08,480
was an alien spacecraft because he did

371
00:16:12,790 --> 00:16:10,480
things that my airplane couldn't do or

372
00:16:13,990 --> 00:16:12,800
no other airplane could do and he had

373
00:16:16,310 --> 00:16:14,000
speeds

374
00:16:18,470 --> 00:16:16,320
that were infinite compared to what i

375
00:16:21,189 --> 00:16:18,480
could handle and i think he had a

376
00:16:23,189 --> 00:16:21,199
propulsion system that was at you

377
00:16:25,269 --> 00:16:23,199
controlled anti-gravity or something

378
00:16:26,629 --> 00:16:25,279
because he just took off

379
00:16:28,310 --> 00:16:26,639
i don't know how the hell he did it

380
00:16:30,389 --> 00:16:28,320
without being plastered up against the

381
00:16:33,350 --> 00:16:30,399
ceiling because there were g-forces

382
00:16:34,310 --> 00:16:33,360
going on there that i couldn't even

383
00:16:36,949 --> 00:16:34,320
imagine

384
00:16:39,430 --> 00:16:36,959
so i have been convinced since then

385
00:16:42,629 --> 00:16:39,440
that was an alien and nobody's gonna

386
00:16:45,269 --> 00:16:42,639
talk me out of that one i did it myself

387
00:16:48,150 --> 00:16:45,279
while these assertions were tauruses and

388
00:16:51,350 --> 00:16:48,160
his alone what did other fighter pilots

389
00:16:53,749 --> 00:16:51,360
think of his statement former usaf

390
00:16:57,269 --> 00:16:53,759
fighter pilot chris leto read the

391
00:16:59,590 --> 00:16:57,279
statement and here gives his thoughts i

392
00:17:01,430 --> 00:16:59,600
think it's uh quite compelling man all

393
00:17:03,110 --> 00:17:01,440
his word everything he uses the actual

394
00:17:05,110 --> 00:17:03,120
account the way he wrote it his

395
00:17:05,750 --> 00:17:05,120
preciseness with certain things certain

396
00:17:08,710 --> 00:17:05,760
of

397
00:17:09,909 --> 00:17:08,720
certain details how he talks

398
00:17:12,309 --> 00:17:09,919
you know really seems like this is a

399
00:17:14,309 --> 00:17:12,319
legit and compelling case so you have

400
00:17:16,710 --> 00:17:14,319
something very large very very large

401
00:17:19,029 --> 00:17:16,720
that was picked up by ground radars

402
00:17:21,110 --> 00:17:19,039
so the raf ground control

403
00:17:24,069 --> 00:17:21,120
intercept could actually see it right

404
00:17:25,990 --> 00:17:24,079
and was able to direct his aircraft onto

405
00:17:28,069 --> 00:17:26,000
it so you had it was seen by the ground

406
00:17:30,150 --> 00:17:28,079
radars and it was picked up by his

407
00:17:32,310 --> 00:17:30,160
fighter radar okay so if you're talking

408
00:17:34,630 --> 00:17:32,320
about jamming how do you jam multiple

409
00:17:36,390 --> 00:17:34,640
different radars at different angles in

410
00:17:39,029 --> 00:17:36,400
different frequencies very very

411
00:17:41,190 --> 00:17:39,039
difficult and not like that okay

412
00:17:44,230 --> 00:17:41,200
that is possible in certain minute

413
00:17:47,510 --> 00:17:44,240
instances but i was electronic attack

414
00:17:48,870 --> 00:17:47,520
expert for four years at the aggressors

415
00:17:50,870 --> 00:17:48,880
and i can tell you it's very difficult

416
00:17:52,470 --> 00:17:50,880
in 1957

417
00:17:54,230 --> 00:17:52,480
i don't see how that would happen and

418
00:17:55,830 --> 00:17:54,240
accelerate away i mean amazing this guy

419
00:17:58,070 --> 00:17:55,840
obviously thinks he was fighting

420
00:18:00,950 --> 00:17:58,080
something real out there it sounds like

421
00:18:02,950 --> 00:18:00,960
it sounds like he was so i don't know

422
00:18:05,590 --> 00:18:02,960
while chris lito finds the case

423
00:18:07,750 --> 00:18:05,600
fascinating and accurate in terms of how

424
00:18:09,830 --> 00:18:07,760
taurus recalled the event and how it

425
00:18:12,070 --> 00:18:09,840
played out between the ground crew and

426
00:18:15,110 --> 00:18:12,080
in the cockpit this doesn't mean that

427
00:18:17,110 --> 00:18:15,120
this aircraft carrier-sized ufo was

428
00:18:19,270 --> 00:18:17,120
definitely alien

429
00:18:20,950 --> 00:18:19,280
could there be a more earthly

430
00:18:24,230 --> 00:18:20,960
explanation

431
00:18:27,029 --> 00:18:24,240
noted ufo historian and researcher david

432
00:18:29,990 --> 00:18:27,039
clarke gives his thoughts on what the

433
00:18:33,830 --> 00:18:30,000
ufo could have possibly been

434
00:18:35,430 --> 00:18:33,840
was it really a ufo was it a um

435
00:18:38,070 --> 00:18:35,440
some kind of soviet aircraft that had

436
00:18:40,070 --> 00:18:38,080
been seen if so who gave the orders to

437
00:18:41,909 --> 00:18:40,080
fire on it and why

438
00:18:43,190 --> 00:18:41,919
the only other possible explanation is

439
00:18:45,350 --> 00:18:43,200
that maybe

440
00:18:47,190 --> 00:18:45,360
um the pilot was involved in some kind

441
00:18:49,190 --> 00:18:47,200
of experiment involving electronic

442
00:18:52,470 --> 00:18:49,200
warfare uh because we now know because

443
00:18:54,310 --> 00:18:52,480
the cia have admitted this that um

444
00:18:57,190 --> 00:18:54,320
they did have a program

445
00:18:59,190 --> 00:18:57,200
in the 1960s called palladium which

446
00:19:01,350 --> 00:18:59,200
involved the creation of phantom

447
00:19:04,390 --> 00:19:01,360
aircraft on radar and this was done

448
00:19:05,830 --> 00:19:04,400
basically to fool um the russians and so

449
00:19:08,789 --> 00:19:05,840
that they could test the capabilities of

450
00:19:10,150 --> 00:19:08,799
russian radar systems and so maybe

451
00:19:11,830 --> 00:19:10,160
there's a remote possibility that

452
00:19:14,230 --> 00:19:11,840
perhaps what this pilot had seen was

453
00:19:17,990 --> 00:19:14,240
some kind of experiment in electronic

454
00:19:20,470 --> 00:19:18,000
warfare or maybe it was a ufo

455
00:19:23,350 --> 00:19:20,480
no matter what it was or wasn't that

456
00:19:25,270 --> 00:19:23,360
milton taurus witnessed he was convinced

457
00:19:27,350 --> 00:19:25,280
it was from another world

458
00:19:31,110 --> 00:19:27,360
and while we may never truly know what

459
00:19:33,830 --> 00:19:31,120
it was the release of the mod ufo files

460
00:19:36,870 --> 00:19:33,840
which included his written testimony was

461
00:19:38,789 --> 00:19:36,880
vindication enough for him to finally

462
00:19:42,470 --> 00:19:38,799
tell his story

463
00:19:44,789 --> 00:19:42,480
a story of a pilot and a man truly

464
00:19:47,110 --> 00:19:44,799
changed by this mystery

465
00:19:48,470 --> 00:19:47,120
somewhere in the skies

466
00:19:50,710 --> 00:19:48,480
the mod

467
00:19:56,150 --> 00:19:50,720
released the story

468
00:19:58,310 --> 00:19:57,040
what a relief

469
00:20:11,350 --> 00:19:58,320
[Music]

470
00:20:14,070 --> 00:20:11,360
audio clips for this episode are

471
00:20:18,230 --> 00:20:14,080
credited to edit international ron

472
00:20:20,310 --> 00:20:18,240
leitner chris leto and ufo tv

473
00:20:21,990 --> 00:20:20,320
please take just a few moments to rate

474
00:20:25,430 --> 00:20:22,000
and review somewhere in the skies on

475
00:20:27,750 --> 00:20:25,440
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476
00:20:31,029 --> 00:20:27,760
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477
00:20:33,270 --> 00:20:31,039
visibility and find new listeners

478
00:20:36,789 --> 00:20:33,280
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479
00:20:39,110 --> 00:20:36,799
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00:20:41,510 --> 00:20:39,120
to our youtube channel official store

481
00:20:42,950 --> 00:20:41,520
and website can all be found in the show

482
00:20:45,110 --> 00:20:42,960
notes

483
00:20:47,990 --> 00:20:45,120
thank you so much for listening and

484
00:20:50,470 --> 00:20:48,000
remember keep your feet on the ground

485
00:20:59,950 --> 00:20:50,480
but never stop searching somewhere in

486
00:21:13,070 --> 00:21:11,160
[Music]

487
00:21:34,310 --> 00:21:13,080
[Applause]

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00:21:36,230 --> 00:21:34,320
[Music]

489
00:21:38,310 --> 00:21:36,240
somewhere in the skies is produced by

490
00:21:40,230 --> 00:21:38,320
third kind productions in association